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 HR2_Vega (BMHD Retrowave 1)

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Arkh

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PostSubject: HR2_Vega (BMHD Retrowave 1)   Sat Dec 26, 2009 3:22 am

BrokenMUGEN HD Retrowave 1 public release : HR2 Vega

Character Sprites : Capcom Vs SNK 2 (Capcom)
Character LR coding : Warusaki3 (http://www.geocities.jp/warusaki3/)
Character HR2 conversion : BMHR Team

HR2_Vega (Street Fighter 2, Capcom)

Screenshot in wide mode (1280*800) downsized in 640*400
(click on screenshot to open it and use the magnifier/mouse to see it real size).


FPS 1280*800 32 bits : min 25 FPS, average 29.8 FPS, maximum 33 FPS
(Check the performance topic in the "BrokenMUGEN HD Engine specs & DL" section to see our platform test)

Disclaimer : This character is an HR2 conversion. It have been designed for BrokenMUGEN HD Engine and doesn't works on any HR Mugen.

Download size : 39 Mo
Character size : 67.7 Mo


HR2_Vega (Street Fighter 2, Capcom)
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LOLWUT



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PostSubject: Re: HR2_Vega (BMHD Retrowave 1)   Sat Dec 26, 2009 3:53 am

Why do you keep on saying the name of the game in which the character originaly appeared instead of the game from which this version of the character really comes from ? As you know, it's the CVS2 version, not the SF2 one.

Even more importantly, why isn't any of his FX scaled to the correct resolution ?
- It looks bad. Just from the screenshot, it clearly doesn't look right to see the Psycho Power FX twice bigger, on both axes, than Vega. It should wrap him nicely. It's just a matter of changing the scale in the CNS code.
- You keep promoting, from what I see, your engine and stuff because you're displaying all the sprites at their native resoltion. None of the FX of any of your characters are at the native resolution, but rather doubled size, which, as said in the previous point, looks bad.
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PostSubject: Re: HR2_Vega (BMHD Retrowave 1)   Sat Dec 26, 2009 4:14 am

Quote :
Even more importantly, why isn't any of his FX scaled to the correct resolution ?
- It looks bad. Just from the screenshot, it clearly doesn't look right to see the Psycho Power FX twice bigger, on both axes, than Vega. It should wrap him nicely. It's just a matter of changing the scale in the CNS code.

I quote Vyx :

Quote :
Y, i know.
We create a game, not mugen stuffs.
Our development map is by phasis which is, for now, main content development.
Accurates debug phasis will be BrokenMUGEN HD RCx releases.
(But for stages sliding, it's fixed on last stages and debugged updates will be available soon for older ones...)

Quote :
- You keep promoting, from what I see, your engine and stuff because you're displaying all the sprites at their native resoltion. None of the FX of any of your characters are at the native resolution, but rather doubled size, which, as said in the previous point, looks bad.

Wrong, 30% of the HR2 chars FX are yet real pixel size.
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Admin
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PostSubject: Re: HR2_Vega (BMHD Retrowave 1)   Sat Dec 26, 2009 4:22 am

Lolwut,

We could have include in BrokenMUGEN HD, LR & HR chars like are doing the noobies of the community in V 1.0.

We have decided to adapt all the chars we include real pixel size which is an Hardwork.

Instead of criticize our work progression, help us and rescale some CNS. You will be credited for your works.

Boring to have guys who criticize and bring nothing. We know all what you say, we have invented the current state of HD Mugen.
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LOLWUT



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PostSubject: Re: HR2_Vega (BMHD Retrowave 1)   Sat Dec 26, 2009 5:07 am

Wow, Admin, no need to get all defensive when someone doesn't say "WOW AWESOME WORK GUYS". I'm only saying my opinion on the graphics. I can't say anything on the code, since it was done by Warusaki3 and is perfect already, so I'm commenting on what you did,that's all.

Quote :
We create a game, not mugen stuffs.
Then why don't the characters blend together ? If you're creating a game, then all the characters should have the same gameplay and same graphic style. I see some characters come from 3D games, while others come from CVS. Some are real HR chars while others are LR filtered to HR, some chars are real 6 button chars, while others are 4 buttons, while others have strikers. Some have CVS2 gameplay while others have MVC2 gameplay... A real game should have everything having the same gameplay. Honestly, this looks like a compilation of things made by other people, without any real edit to the code to make every character blend correctly with each other. Neutral
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PostSubject: Re: HR2_Vega (BMHD Retrowave 1)   Sun Dec 27, 2009 4:02 am

Quote :
Wow, Admin, no need to get all defensive when someone doesn't say "WOW AWESOME WORK GUYS".

Admin says that's is easy to criticize a work in progression, particulary when it's an hardwork which include news formats developments. And i say too that people who develop nothing should develop stuffs instead of criticize those who bring news things to mugen.

Quote :
Then why don't the characters blend together ? If you're creating a game, then all the characters should have the same gameplay and same graphic style. I see some characters come from 3D games, while others come from CVS. Some are real HR chars while others are LR filtered to HR, some chars are real 6 button chars, while others are 4 buttons, while others have strikers. Some have CVS2 gameplay while others have MVC2 gameplay

1/ Unlike on V 1.0, all our chars have the same DPI
2/ Unlike on V 1.0, our chars have the same DPI than the HD stages
3/ Our HR2 3D chars fit perfectly well with HR2 2D chars, because they have the same DPI
4/ We create a game with chars we like and we want they keep their original gameplay
5/ If you want to play CVS2, install mame and play CVS2. Our goal is not to copy CVS2 or SVC, our goal is to create a game with chars we like from every games, keeping originals gameplays from these games.
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LOLWUT



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PostSubject: Re: HR2_Vega (BMHD Retrowave 1)   Sun Dec 27, 2009 11:29 am

1 & 2) I don't see why you keep comparing yourself with Mugen 1.0. The stuff you're developping is to blend all together "with the same DPI". People develop(ed) for old DOS Mugen, Winmugen, and now Mugen 1.0 in a totally heterogeneous way, since everybody develops what he wants. This results in some stuff for Mugen being LR, HR, HD or whatever. And point number 2 is false : if somebody plays with only GGXX characters in HR stages with 640*480 resolution, then everything will have the same DPI. If people play with Mugen 1.0 in HD stages with 1280*720 resolution, but with HR or LR characters only, it's because no real HD char has been released yet (and no, resizing a HR character to scale=0.5,0.5 doesn't count as making a character HD. It will have the same DPI, but nobody cares about characters twice too small).

3) Your tastes, but really, that's flawed. Street Fighter 2 on SNes and SF3 on Dreamcast have the same 320*240 resolution. They are both made by Capcom, with some characters being "the same" (Ryu, Ken, Chunli are all there), but it doesn't mean that the sprites blend correctly together at all, since the sprite styles are COMPLETELY DIFFERENT.

4) Don't mean that you're "compiling a game" with chars you like and you want they keep their original gameplay ? Creating would mean that you're actually coding everything, ripping or creating sprites and sounds, etc.

5) Well, don't worry for me, I have CVS2 on Dreamcast, PS2 and 2 emulators.
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PostSubject: Re: HR2_Vega (BMHD Retrowave 1)   Sun Dec 27, 2009 1:24 pm

Quote :
1 & 2) I don't see why you keep comparing yourself with Mugen 1.0. The stuff you're developping is to blend all together "with the same DPI". People develop(ed) for old DOS Mugen, Winmugen, and now Mugen 1.0 in a totally heterogeneous way, since everybody develops what he wants. This results in some stuff for Mugen being LR, HR, HD or whatever. And point number 2 is false : if somebody plays with only GGXX characters in HR stages with 640*480 resolution, then everything will have the same DPI.

Right... but this DPI is real pixel size in a 640*480 window, we bring real pixel size to full screen.

Quote :
If people play with Mugen 1.0 in HD stages with 1280*720 resolution, but with HR or LR characters only, it's because no real HD char has been released yet (and no, resizing a HR character to scale=0.5,0.5 doesn't count as making a character HD. It will have the same DPI, but nobody cares about characters twice too small).

Wrong, we have released the first HD char worldwide, HD Paladin Elvaan for BrokenMUGEN HD. And we have released the first HD char worldwide for V1.0 too, HD Puppetmaster Elvaan. They have native HD DPI in normal size.

http://www.brokenmugenhr.com/8.html

Quote :
3) Your tastes, but really, that's flawed. Street Fighter 2 on SNes and SF3 on Dreamcast have the same 320*240 resolution. They are both made by Capcom, with some characters being "the same" (Ryu, Ken, Chunli are all there), but it doesn't mean that the sprites blend correctly together at all, since the sprite styles are COMPLETELY DIFFERENT.

Our game concept is to create an HD game which allow to have some fights between chars from final fantasy, street fighter 2, samurai shodown, Marvel vs Capcom, king of fighters, Killer Instinct, Mortal Kombat, basara X, hokuto no ken, guilty gear...
So, sprites have differents styles but have the same HR2 format (size & DPI).

Quote :
4) Don't mean that you're "compiling a game" with chars you like and you want they keep their original gameplay ? Creating would mean that you're actually coding everything, ripping or creating sprites and sounds, etc.

We don't code everything, we code what we need to code to have only HD 960 stages and HR2 chars in our HD engine.
We have created most of our HD stages.
We don't use LR & HR formats because they are upscaled in HD res. So we have to reworks chars to adapt them to HR2 format.
Workcharge depends of the chars.
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PostSubject: Re: HR2_Vega (BMHD Retrowave 1)   Sun Dec 27, 2009 1:48 pm

Quote :
Our game concept is to create an HD game which allow to have some fights between chars from final fantasy, street fighter 2, samurai shodown, Marvel vs Capcom, king of fighters, Killer Instinct, Mortal Kombat, basara X, hokuto no ken, guilty gear...
So, sprites have differents styles but have the same HR2 format (size & DPI).
Okay, I understand your idea. Have you thought about the gameplay though ? Having different styles for the graphics is not so important IMO (some people create CVS gameplay chars with KOF sprites and vice-versa), but to make it feel like a real fullgame, it is essential that every characterplays with the same gameplay system (same number of buttons, same system techniques such as parry, just defend, air dash, etc.).
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PostSubject: Re: HR2_Vega (BMHD Retrowave 1)   Sun Dec 27, 2009 2:22 pm

Quote :
Okay, I understand your idea. Have you thought about the gameplay though ? Having different styles for the graphics is not so important IMO (some people create CVS gameplay chars with KOF sprites and vice-versa), but to make it feel like a real fullgame, it is essential that every characterplays with the same gameplay system (same number of buttons, same system techniques such as parry, just defend, air dash, etc.).

Because the cool thing in an MK vs SF fight is to have MK gameplay vs SF gameplay.
We don't want BrokenMUGEN HD feel like a real full game. We want :

- it feel for mugen users like the HD Mugen which have his content adapted to HD.
- it feel for people who doesn't know Mugen like a "ready to play" PC game which include chars from every fight games.
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PostSubject: Re: HR2_Vega (BMHD Retrowave 1)   Sat Jan 02, 2010 7:09 am

Okay, so when I press any button in Training Mode, Vega does a Super move ...
And when I grab the opponent with F+2P or F+2K, the move is so badly binded to the opponent it's horrible ...
The new hitsparks are full of colorloss ... might as well have kept the old ones.

. . .
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PostSubject: Re: HR2_Vega (BMHD Retrowave 1)   Mon Jan 04, 2010 2:01 am

LOLWUT wrote:
Okay, so when I press any button in Training Mode, Vega does a Super move ...

False, you write bullshits.

Quote :
And when I grab the opponent with F+2P or F+2K, the move is so badly binded to the opponent it's horrible ...

right, grab distance have to be fixed.

Quote :
The new hitsparks are full of colorloss ... might as well have kept the old ones.
. . .

False, news hits sparks have far better visual rendering than old one.

Stop spammin bullshits here Lolwuts, you can say all the truth you want, but not bullshits. You're not a the noobieguild.
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PostSubject: Re: HR2_Vega (BMHD Retrowave 1)   Mon Jan 04, 2010 2:32 am

Quote :
False, you write bullshits.
Did you even TRY the character ? Because really, as soon as he gets one powerbar, he'll perform a super if you press any button.
Not even able to accept the truth without testing ? Now that's REAL BULLSHIT !!!
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PostSubject: Re: HR2_Vega (BMHD Retrowave 1)   Mon Jan 04, 2010 3:21 am

Listen wolwut,

You come since the start to attack our works, to defend stealers of our works...

We all know you're probably one of the mentally retarded guys of the fake "community".

If you don't like our works, do better. Until that, shut the fuck up.

Or we ban you. Is it clear ?

As all the community allied to elecbyte are unable to create something coherent in HD... i really don't think you will do better alone...

Did you have at least, bring something to mugen ? except your big mouth ?
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PostSubject: Re: HR2_Vega (BMHD Retrowave 1)   Mon Jan 04, 2010 5:44 am

So I give you honest feedback concerning this character, and all you can say is that I'm a liar who says bullshit, while obviously none of you have even tested your OWN CHARACTER !!! Come on, just test it, and see if I'm lying about the super performed with one button !

I expressly demand that you test the character and then apologize for being rude without having tested if what I said is true or not.

Quote :
Did you have at least, bring something to mugen ?
And what have you brought to Mugen, since BMHD and Mugen are not compatible without editing ?
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PostSubject: Re: HR2_Vega (BMHD Retrowave 1)   Mon Jan 04, 2010 7:10 am

What we brought to mugen ?


For Winmugen plus :

1/ BrokenMUGEN HR, the Two4teeze BrokenMUGEN screenpack winmugen plus conversion

2/ SeiyaHR, the first working HR chars from saint seiya world with natives HR sprites.

3/ AnegawanotatakaiHR stage, an HR stage from sengoku basara X.

4/ GoukenHR, the HR conversion of alexlexus 2008 Gouken

5/ The first HD engine, BrokenMUGEN HD (which is, for your information, perfectly compatible with every mugen resources except LR stages)

For BrokenMUGEN HD :

6/ The first HD stage format, HD 960. Now we have released 14 of them.

21/The HR2 char format which allow to play old chars with HD DPI. Now we have released 25 of them.

47/The HD char format with the first working HD chars. We have released 2 of them.


For Mugen RCx :

50/The first working HD char, puppetmaster Elvaan HD.


And you Question
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